So just another correlation error, blame the software guys.
Jack might have been wiser to attempt that near the end of the session. I do think it's a good thing having all these rookies in the field again - makes things interesting.
So just another correlation error, blame the software guys.
Jack might have been wiser to attempt that near the end of the session. I do think it's a good thing having all these rookies in the field again - makes things interesting.
Doomlord_uk
Ars Legatus Legionis
Apparently it only turns off automatically if you hit the brakes; if you take a corner at full speed you have to turn it off manually.
That matches my understanding - other than closing when brakes are initially applied, it’s all on the button.
A big “fuck yeah!” for Lawson. He’s got to be feeling a lot better about himself right sbout now.
A big “fuck yeah!” for Lawson. He’s got to be feeling a lot better about himself right sbout now.
The enablement by the FIA for all cars (i.e. "DRS is available" on the TV broadcast) is automated and under race control. And the 1 second gap component during the race is also automated. However, the actual deployment of DRS itself on each individual car is done by the driver manually pressing the DRS button on their steering wheel. However, DRS only closes automatically if they lift off the throttle or hit the brakes. If they do neither, then they have to press the button again to close it. Normally you'd be hitting the brakes or slowing at the end of a long DRS -- think China T1 rotary supercollider -- but Suzuka carries the speed through turn 1.
Of course, in practice sessions, the one second gap doesn't matter and the driver can deploy DRS at their discretion as long as race control has turned it on.
I am a bit surprised that we never get illegal DRS use penalties if it doesn't close automatically. Surely Doohan was out of the zone when he crashed, right? There are other tracks where there's no certain immediate braking at the end of the activation zone. It seems like we would have seen that happen a few times already, especially in qualifying. Maybe it has and I just missed it.
Doomlord_uk
Ars Legatus Legionis
If I understand correctly, there's no "end" to the DRS zone, just a begin line. Theoretically, if a driver could take the entire course flat out, DRS would stay enabled the entire lap. The "end" is a game of chicken for the drivers on who wants to lift/brake/button first.
Wow, didn't know that either - I assumed DRS deactivated automatically at the end of the 'DRS Enabled' zone. I guess most tracks are built so that the end of the long DRS runs have turns that absolutely require straight-line braking to survive them so the deactivation is effectively automatic.
Wonder if anyone else has made that error at Suzuka. The temptation to grab an extra tenth by holding DRS just a tad bit longer than prudent has to be a thing.
The regulations state the following:
* system will be disabled by the control electronics the first time the driver uses the brakes after he (sic!) has activated the system.
The control electronics also only enable DRS use (activated by a button on the steering wheel) when the requirements are met, I.e. you are within one second of the car in front when you pass the DRS detection line.
It seems like there isn’t even a requirement that the driver can manually deactivate DRS via the steering wheel only activate it.
A team can override the control mechanism when the DRS detection doesn’t work and the race director can deactivate DRS use for any reason but usually it’s either because you are on the first lap of the race or the first lap after restart/safety car restart or if weather conditions don‘t allow it.
That's true -- but then you put more energy through the tires and the brakes, potentially leading to early tire degradation and requiring you to take another pit stop, thus negating all those extra tenths.
I don't think that's true. On the circuit maps, there's always a DRS detection point and a DRS activation zone. I believe there are trackside markers and lines for both the start and the end of the zone. Commentators usually talk about the length of the different zones when going over the circuit at the beginning of sessions, too.
It's not spelled out, but on the Suzuka map, you can see the green dashes indicating the activation zone:
https://www.formula1.com/en/racing/2025/japan/circuit
EDIT: And here's an article about changing the length of the DRS zone for Mexico last year. Yes, they're probably just moving the start point, but all the language about changing from 95 to 75 meters clearly indicates that there's an end point. I'm sure it's somewhere on some FIA webpage, but I can't be bothered to look for it.
There‘s an end to the DRS zone but there’s nothing in the regulations that mandates that you have to deactivate DRS at the end of the DRS zone. There’s also no automatic control authority that deactivates DRS for the driver.
DRS automatically closes when you push the brake or manually when you push the button on the steering wheel.
They don’t have a mandate that you need to deactivate DRS at the end of the DRS zone because you eventually get to a turn and - as Doohan has shown spectacularlay - you‘d better turn off DRS anyway to not end up off track due to lack of downforce.
There‘s no automatic system to deactivate DRS because it could startle drivers who didn’t expect DRS to close when it does and it’s also a safety risk if the electronic control system automatically actuates the rear wing should it fail.
I couldn’t believe it myself so I skimmed the FIA sporting and technical regulations and the only requirement is that the driver shall only manually activate the DRS and only when they are in the DRS zone and only if the requirements are met. (within 1 s of the car in front at the detection line)
That's completely mental. We've had DRS for, what, over a decade now, and evidently I also didn't fully understand the rules behind it. I also hadn't realised there wasn't a defined end to the areas by which DRS needs to be disabled again.
I suppose the clue is in the name itself - it's the activation zone. If you're outside the activation zone, then you can't activate DRS. They're obviously relying on the natural characteristics of the track itself to deal with deactivation, basically requiring the drivers to break.
Anyone fancy trying Rettifilo at Monza without braking? You'd then carry a huge advantage through Curva Grande and into Della Roggia (or even the first Lesmo if you're feeling equally brave).
I suppose the clue is in the name itself - it's the activation zone. If you're outside the activation zone, then you can't activate DRS. They're obviously relying on the natural characteristics of the track itself to deal with deactivation, basically requiring the drivers to break.
Anyone fancy trying Rettifilo at Monza without braking? You'd then carry a huge advantage through Curva Grande and into Della Roggia (or even the first Lesmo if you're feeling equally brave).
I think someone else mentioned: Also lifting the throttle will do it - probably with some % threshold. I feel like I've seen this & DRS closing mid-zone when the trailing driver lifted (but not braked) in response to defensive maneuvers from the car ahead.
We may have also seen examples of DRS closing at different points in the braking zone (or leading up to it) at some of the races where there was some DRS-chicken going on at the end the first leg of a double-DRS zone.
If I recall correctly there was one race where Kimi Rakkoinen managed an overtake because he forced the drs to stay open longer while on the brakes, at least, according to the commentary at the time. I just can't recall which race! It was one of his latter Ferrari years, and I'm pretty sure it was Crofty and Brundle doing the commentary as well.
Watching replays of FP1 while getting some work done this morning, I found myself absolutely hating the livery that RB chose for Japan. Not only are they almost indistinguishable at a glance from the junior team, but it's also different enough from the usual RB colours that they don't register.
I get that it's a Honda tribute and white with a red sun was traditionally Japan's scheme back in the day, but they could have done more to distinguish the two teams; the little bits of yellow on the VCARB aren't enough. This is going to suck during the race.
I get that it's a Honda tribute and white with a red sun was traditionally Japan's scheme back in the day, but they could have done more to distinguish the two teams; the little bits of yellow on the VCARB aren't enough. This is going to suck during the race.
I want to say that was James Hinchcliffe because he was standing at T1 and T2 reporting for F1TV when the crash happened.
If you watch Alonso's spin into the gravel / dirt you can tell the wind is very, very strong. That dust cloud was moving.
I'd love to hear more of a technical post-mortem on that crash. Lots of commentary on F1 forums that he did tap the brakes according to telemetry, but didn't tap enough perhaps? He seemed utterly confused right after the crash on the radio, like he expected the downforce grip.
All hearsay of course for now.
They have got to come up with something more to try to mitigate this further, but I don't know what that would be. This is going to wreck quali and the race the way this is going.
Oh I know it'll stop during quali but we've seen how those red flags can really screw with things. I suppose that could end up being a good thing depending on how you look at it. I wasn't aware of the weather forecast, so thank you for that. Possible flames aside, looking forward to quali after watching some of those runs on the softs there towards the end.
I had to laugh when I read this post because I then remembered that the Cardiologist I had a procedure done by last Friday is named Dr. Haas.1) Hmm.
2) Point of order, as I was making this mistake all the time and it was pointed out to me by both folks in the F1 threads and then by people who work for Haas
https://www.haascnc.com/index.html
View attachment 106802
I need to drive by the Haas corporate HQ again soon - it’s about 5 miles from here.
I think they have that Haas F1 Team logo out front of the building someplace.
That was unexpected. Looked like Norris clobbered the curbs at the final chicane, and Piastri sounded like he screwed up T1/T2.
Happy for Hadjar since it sounded like he was in some extreme discomfort.
Happy for Hadjar since it sounded like he was in some extreme discomfort
.
Really looking forward to him aggressively defending from the inside and driving out wide to force another driver off the track, then bitching about it like mad on the radio.
But it WAS a helluva a lap!
Clearly he is an android pretending to be a human. Every year, year after year, Max pulls some magic out of his hat. Race start is going to be anxiety inducing
Doomlord_uk
Ars Legatus Legionis
Too early to say, I think. He crashed out of a wet Australian race that saw veteran drivers also leave the track. 13th was not a terrible finish for a rookie in Shanghai. Then he was denied a practice run in Japan before crashing out of FP2, and I'm not sure the FP2 crash was entirely his fault--either he expected DRS to shut off and it didn't, or the sim convinced him he didn't need to shut it off in the first place.
He's also in a kind of Liam Lawson situation since F1 fandom assumes the Hirakawa signing has doomed Doohan's career.
He's also in a kind of Liam Lawson situation since F1 fandom assumes the Hirakawa signing has doomed Doohan's career.
It’s raining right now at Suzuka, per the weather people.
Forecast has it raining for the next hour, hour and a half or do. Then intermittent showers through until about an hour after the race start.
Going to be an interesting day…
Forecast has it raining for the next hour, hour and a half or do. Then intermittent showers through until about an hour after the race start.
Going to be an interesting day…
This.
I read The Race article about it and this is what I found missing. They talk about muscle memory on the sim being a factor, but they never said whether or not the sim accurately depicted what the actual car would do in a similar situation. It seemed the article was implying that in the sim the DRS would deactivate, and it didn't in the actual car. ...but the article never made that clear.
Also the article didn't make it clear if it was Doohan's intention to completely go through the turn without DRS.
I did read that they can adjust DRS deactivation on either brake activation or based on throttle position. My guess is that it could be very hard to sync up the electronics in the car with what happens in the sim.
I would like to think that the engineers would analyze what the driver is doing in the sim as well as with telemetry in car and give feedback on stuff like "remember to deactive DRS just to be sure!"....that is why I reserve any criticism towards Doohan for what happened in practice.