The Home Improvement and DIY Thread

[KD5MDK]

From what you see on the shelf, or did you actually talk to electricians? Knipex and Klein are, by far, the top choice for every commercial electrician around here. The handymen/DIYers are buying Milwaukee hand tools because that's what HD is pushing now, not because they are better.

I meant power tools, not hand tools. Which is probably not what was the overall point here.

Going to be building the workbench tops for my miter saw and rip fence.

Obviously want this as flat as possible. I’ll be using 3/4” plywood for the top. These will attach to stud walls clad with 3/4” plywood.

I’m considering two ways to build the frame for it.

1) rip down plywood and double/triple it up for the pieces that will support the 3/4” plywood bench top.

Or

2) Get the straightest 2x4’s I can, cut them a few inches longer, and then run them trough my table saw to get one perfectly flat side lengthwise. That way I’ll have one flat side to square off the ends in the miter saw.

Leaning towards 2. I’ve got some pretty darn straight 2x4’s, I think that would yield best results with the least waste.

If you want a flat surface, why not use MDF instead of plywood?
For the frame, you could also rip a 2x6 in half and have pretty straight (on one side) on two pieces at once.
Then you have to figure out how flat your floor is.

 

[abernat]

I'm not sure about 2x4s - even if straight they might warp over time. How rigid do you want it to be?

 

[Cool Modine]

I meant power tools, not hand tools. Which is probably not what was the overall point here.

If you want a flat surface, why not use MDF instead of plywood?
For the frame, you could also rip a 2x6 in half and have pretty straight (on one side) on two pieces at once.
Then you have to figure out how flat your floor is.

Ply sags less than MDF. I’d chose ply over MDF for flat surfaces unless I know I’m going to support it well.

 

[hansmuff]

Ply sags less than MDF. I’d chose ply over MDF for flat surfaces unless I know I’m going to support it well.

An aside... would you mind telling a novice why that is? Thanks!

 

[Drizzt321]

I think it's that MDF has no real structural strength. It's basically saw dust and glue, more or less. Plywood had layers of thin wood, in alternating directions, then glued together providing for some structural strength in both directions, and then the some strength pulling/pushing against each other in the direction opposite the force, e.g. gravity pulling stuff down.

1/2" is still fairly flexible, but when you get to 3/4" or thicker it gets quite sturdy, and in some ways stronger than than solid wood of similar side, especially most soft woods.

 

[Xenocrates]

From what you see on the shelf, or did you actually talk to electricians? Knipex and Klein are, by far, the top choice for every commercial electrician around here. The handymen/DIYers are buying Milwaukee hand tools because that's what HD is pushing now, not because they are better.

Knipex, Klein, Greenlee. Milwaukee packout was popular, then Klein did their version (Which Milwaukee is suing over because they feel they own modular plastic storage, ignoring Systainers being a decade earlier). Which is probably part of why Milwaukee is trying to get Klein out of HD. They want to cut off income and make the lawsuit as painful as possible to fight.

For power tools, that's very dependent on the age. Older guys typically have beat to shit heavy Dewalt or Hilti tools, unless they do a bunch of specialist stuff, then it's either a clusterfuck or Makita (since that's Greenlee's battery partner). Younger guys are big on Milwaukee, and typically can't afford the good stuff like Hilti or the specialized stuff that pushes you into Makita batteries.

Personally, as an industrial electrican doing maintenance, about the only thing I use regularly from Milwaukee is a sub-compact portaband, and that's just because it's what the company bought to cut strut. Otherwise, I prefer Makita (I do not have the specialized Greenlee tools) because I've been beating on them for years and have yet to kill one, even driving a 6" hole saw on a medium duty drill. Meanwhile, we've killed several newer Dewalt drills and light impacts.

 

[meisanerd]

I think it somewhat depends too on what was available when you were buying tools. I know a few mechanics that jumped on the Milwaukee because they had the cordless impacts at the time that did the job that the other brands in that price bracket couldn't, and since they were now in on that battery setup, have just expanded their tool collection with more Milwaukee stuff.

 

[GaitherBill]

Got the plywood up on the 8' of wall I studded out. The unpainted section on the left.

Next up is to cut the outlet in on the left side.

And then I'll build the 14' x 3' worktable in front of both of those plywood walls.

That worktable will hold the miter saw and a rip fence system.

That hood on the right will come down and go elsewhere. It's a condensate hood for beer brewing.

Also to be installed is a proper dust collector that arrived yesterday.

 

[abernat]

I'm not sure about 2x4s - even if straight they might warp over time. How rigid do you want it to be?

I think it's that MDF has no real structural strength. It's basically saw dust and glue, more or less. Plywood had layers of thin wood, in alternating directions, then glued together providing for some structural strength in both directions, and then the some strength pulling/pushing against each other in the direction opposite the force, e.g. gravity pulling stuff down.

1/2" is still fairly flexible, but when you get to 3/4" or thicker it gets quite sturdy, and in some ways stronger than than solid wood of similar side, especially most soft woods.

Yep! MDF is wonderful to work with (other than the dust), machines well, takes paint well, is flat, but it'll also bend like Gumby. Plywood is stronger, solid wood is strongest against sag - but solid wood will also move the most. Plywood moves less because the grain alternates directions, MDF moves the least. tl, dr: you can't win.

BTW, a website like https://woodbin.com/calcs/sagulator/ is fantastic for estimating sag for things like bookshelves.

@GaitherBill, did you consider a torsion box design for your worktop? I should have recommended that sooner. It will be dead flat (if built dead flat) and require minimal support (e.g. https://www.finewoodworking.com/2007/05/15/build-a-torsion-box-assembly-table). Sag resistance increases as depth increases, and a torsion box lets you create a very lightweight assembly with decent (2-3") depth.

 

[Drizzt321]

@GaitherBill, did you consider a torsion box design for your worktop? I should have recommended that sooner. It will be dead flat (if built dead flat) and require minimal support (e.g. https://www.finewoodworking.com/2007/05/15/build-a-torsion-box-assembly-table). Sag resistance increases as depth increases, and a torsion box lets you create a very lightweight assembly with decent (2-3") depth.

Must be nice to have both a joiner & planer.

 

[Tom the Melaniephile]

If you want a flat surface, why not use MDF instead of plywood?

Hey, now I know what to do with my leftover MDF. Cover the top of my plywood-topped workbench.

 

[Drizzt321]

Hey, now I know what to do with my leftover MDF. Cover the top of my plywood-topped workbench.

assuming the plywood is pretty flat across it's surface right now. Get a long straight edge and check for that first.

 

[GaitherBill]

To end the suspense, I'm sure there's a lot, I bought 12 more 2x4's atLowes this morning.

They're the more expensive ones that are "more straighter".

Gonna use those for the worktop frame. I'll straighten them out as needed, but they're all pretty good to begin with.

The rip fence setup will be made out of ripped down plywood.

 

[Tom the Melaniephile]

assuming the plywood is pretty flat across it's surface right now. Get a long straight edge and check for that first.

It's relatively flat other than some gouges, texture and manufacturing imperfections. Workbench was here when I bought the house.

I can either use my hand plane on high spots and/or just let the MDF sag how it likes over time.

 

[Drizzt321]

It's relatively flat other than some gouges, texture and manufacturing imperfections. Workbench was here when I bought the house.

I can either use my hand plane on high spots and/or just let the MDF sag how it likes over time.

Perhaps on the highest spots, but perhaps just needs a touch of a hand sander to the rougher bits and good enough.

 

[Ananke]

Must be nice to have both a joiner & planer.

A machine jointer would be nice, but it doesn't take an excessive amount of work to achieve a pretty respectable precision with a jointing plane and an engineering square. Which, for reference, cost me less than a single pair of spare blades for a lunchbox thicknesser. I get better results with a hand plane than the stuff I can buy pre-planed.

Best size depends on your preference, physical strength, and the size of the workpiece - running a #8 for any length of time will give your arms a considerable workout. If you're prepared to pay sufficient attention to detail you can do it with a #3, but a proper jointer (at least a #6) makes it a damn sight easier.

 

[KD5MDK]

If you just want jointing to be one flat surface or parallel flat ones, you can do that with a tablesaw.

 

[Drizzt321]

If you just want jointing to be one flat surface or parallel flat ones, you can do that with a tablesaw.

Speaking of which, I should double check how straight my blade/fence is sooner or later, make sure it's acceptable parameters to me. Pretty sure it is.

 

[KD5MDK]

Whatever it is, it probably isn't acceptable for JasterMereel. Unless you have it dialed in to ~.015, including the necessary angle to prevent binding..

 

[Drizzt321]

Is that of a mm or of an inch?

 

[abernat]

Y'all are reminding me of Pat Warner, may he rest in peace.

 

[JasterMereel]

I made a mount for my jack stands today.

Final version.


Just the wood and the little hooks.


First pass at storing the wheel chocks. This wasn't a good idea.


This is a much better idea for storing the wheel chocks.


The mounting piece of wood is from my scrap pile and it is mounted into the studs with 6 3" screws. Each of the hooks has 2 1.5" screws into it. It feels that the metal hooks could bend if I put all of my weight on them, but with a static hold for each jack stand, they seem fine. The two SUV jack stands on the left touch the wall at the bottom of the stands. The two regular stands on the right are just free floating. I am much happier with the wheel chocks hanging down instead of sitting on top of the jack stands. The jack stands are high enough so that I'm not running into them with my head or anything like that. I do need 2 hands to take them down and lift them up which isn't a big deal.

But still, it is awesome to have these off the floor and out of the way.

 

[Drizzt321]

Looks good! Bonus thought, add 2 extra smaller hooks to hang the chocks up? That way you don't have to pull down the stands if you just need the chocks for a short bit, without the stands.

 

[JasterMereel]

Looks good! Bonus thought, add 2 extra smaller hooks to hang the chocks up? That way you don't have to pull down the stands if you just need the chocks for a short bit, without the stands.

That's a good idea about 2 more hooks for the chocks. The thing though is with my current setup, I can't really think of a situation where I would need the chocks but not need the jack stands. Something I have to think about though. I might just order another set of hooks since they were only $8.

 

[Drizzt321]

That's a good idea about 2 more hooks for the chocks. The thing though is with my current setup, I can't really think of a situation where I would need the chocks but not need the jack stands. Something I have to think about though. I might just order another set of hooks since they were only $8.

Hm, you're just stopping by for a few days before continuing on? You just have moved it around a bit? I dunno...

I'm curious why you just don't store the chocks with the trailer/RV/what not. Mine live (when not in use) in the side accessible storage area.

 

[Ecmaster76]

I made a mount for my jack stands today.

Not gonna lie, I hope Wile E Coyote stays away from your garage

Spoiler

 

[JasterMereel]

Hm, you're just stopping by for a few days before continuing on? You just have moved it around a bit? I dunno...

I'm curious why you just don't store the chocks with the trailer/RV/what not. Mine live (when not in use) in the side accessible storage area.

I don't have a trailer. I have the wheel chocks for chocking the wheels whenever I work on my cars.

 

[Drizzt321]

I don't have a trailer. I have the wheel chocks for chocking the wheels whenever I work on my cars.

Oh, I see. At which point you're probably using your stands anyways, right.

 

[JasterMereel]

You got it

 

[JasterMereel]

I also cleaned up my spare wood & scraps and got rid of a bunch of it. I still have plenty though.

 

[Tom the Melaniephile]

I also cleaned up my spare wood & scraps and got rid of a bunch of it. I still have plenty though.

Make some biochar for your gardening

 

[GodFather]

Oh, I see. At which point you're probably using your stands anyways, right.

But if he's working on his SUV he still needs to take down the standard car jacks to get the chocks so your point still "stands"

 

[JasterMereel]

I hate working with ratchet straps. I watched a few videos on how to use ratchet straps. I still hate them, but now I know how to use them better.

 

[GaitherBill]

I find that most ratchet strap hate comes from improperly storing them.

 

[Scifigod]

Right up there with Christmas lights in the "no matter how hard you try they'll become a tangled ball of frustration" category.

 

[Drizzt321]

I find that most ratchet strap hate comes from improperly storing them.

That's the most frustrating part of ratchet straps. Otherwise, I love them.

Also a couple of twists and you don't lose that much of its rated strength, but you get a LOT less humming from the wind.


Question: what's the best way to cut just a little tiny bit from this old laminate backslash in my trailer? I need it just a tiny bit wider. Reciprocating tool? And cut the top by hand across to where I need it to be?

EDIT: Also, would ya'll trust this plug if I just wanted to add a single outlet, instead of the double? I want to put my battery monitor interface here, instead of a double outlet. And in terms of wiring, do I actually need to get romex? Or can I use generic 14/3 stranded, so long as it's rated to 120v? I only need something like 3-5 ft. Or can I get away with 16/3, or even 18/3? It'd be at most a 15a circuit, more likely a couple of amps usage at a time. And is it find to crimp (ratcheting crimp) the blade push on? Or is 10-15a (worst case usage) too much for those and I should rethink?

 

[JasterMereel]

That's the most frustrating part of ratchet straps. Otherwise, I love them.

Also a couple of twists and you don't lose that much of its rated strength, but you get a LOT less humming from the wind.


Question: what's the best way to cut just a little tiny bit from this old laminate backslash in my trailer? I need it just a tiny bit wider. Reciprocating tool? And cut the top by hand across to where I need it to be?

View attachment 102286

Oscillitating tool with the proper blade

 

[doraemon]

Agreed on the oscillating tool, with the appropriate blade, of course (not sure how hard that laminate is). Maybe tape a piece of wood to serve as a guide to keep it straight?

 

[Ecmaster76]

Question: what's the best way to cut just a little tiny bit from this old laminate backslash in my trailer? I need it just a tiny bit wider. Reciprocating tool? And cut the top by hand across to where I need it to be?

View attachment 102286

I'd use an oscillating saw

They are super handy for precise cuts and you wont have to worry about cracking the board or tear out
Do some practice cuts first to get a feel for it and maybe use a straight edge or jig to help keep the blade from slipping

edit: freaking ninjas...

 

[Deleted member 46272]

EDIT: Also, would ya'll trust this plug

They state that the plug is rated for up to 15A and then they state that it has 18AWG wiring. This sets off alarm bells - If this were freely mounted with short wiring, I may, possibly, trust it with up to something like 12A, but there is no way I'd run 18AWG wiring in a bundle for several feet and trust it with 15A. That's WAY outside NEC spec.

Romex can only be safely run in protected areas (it's soft, easily damaged, not UV-resistant, and not waterproof) and as it is solid wiring (not stranded) it must not be able to move around once installed and doesn't tolerate vibration well. I would probably go with 14AWG or 12AWG stranded cord if I were wiring a trailer, crimp lugs or ring terminals on the ends (don't just twist and clamp the ends directly into lugs or outlet terminals), and then use than to connect my wiring. For an outlet, I'd consider using a standard outlet, perhaps out-door rated, and remember that you don't have a "real" ground, so I would even consider a GFI outlet.