A real-life pod racer, but with pedals: Ars checks out a velomobile
- Thread starter JournalBot
- Start date
It's not THAT dangerous, although it does require proper precautions. And you can buy a LOT of fiberglass for $8,000. You can buy a lot of fiberglass for $200. Doing it in your backyard instead of a garage takes care of the space and smell problem.
Upvote
2
(2
/
0)
Upvote
35
(35
/
0)
Which is one of the reasons you won't find them with electric support. While you can build them with support up to 25 km/h and still have the bikes treated as bicycles (in the EU), anything more powerful will require testing and a lot regulatory hassle to get them admitted. Not worth it for the numbers we're talking about here. And support up to 25 km/h may be sufficient for something extra when going up hills, on the flat it is absolutely nothing.
Upvote
4
(4
/
0)
idk, I can see a lot of appeal in the idea of a "hilltopper" motor, especially with the extra weight.
Upvote
10
(10
/
0)
In the Netherlands it is no contest, we don't have hills, we have wind. But also in Germany I don't see a lot of these with a "hilltopper". There is a big difference between what you think you need before you start riding, and what you actually need.
Upvote
3
(3
/
0)
Fred Duck asked:
"This may be a silly question but how is flipping the vehicle related to blankets?"
.
Flat repair. Many owners just lay the thing on its side to fix a flat, on a blanket.
I never did. I'd remove the tire from rim with wheel staying on machine.
Then I'd put a cloth, any kind of cloth, under wheel rim while I fixed the cause of the flat.
You can see the cloth, an extra shirt, in this pic.
"This may be a silly question but how is flipping the vehicle related to blankets?"
.
Flat repair. Many owners just lay the thing on its side to fix a flat, on a blanket.
I never did. I'd remove the tire from rim with wheel staying on machine.
Then I'd put a cloth, any kind of cloth, under wheel rim while I fixed the cause of the flat.
You can see the cloth, an extra shirt, in this pic.
Upvote
10
(10
/
0)
Depends on your intended use and whether that is expensive or not.
Average car in the US is $8,500 annual costs.
So a velomobile is slightly more expensive than a car the first year, then very low cost for the next 9 years.
Upvote
22
(22
/
0)
Hopefully it doesn't break during those ten years because when I used my bike a lot it tended to need regular maintenance.
Upvote
-6
(2
/
-8)
In the 12,000 miles I've put on my velomobile, it needed:
.
1. Twist grip shifter, about $40
2. Turn signal relay, about $30
3. A master link, about $2
4. A jockey wheel, about $20
.
Some tires regularly, and a chain at 9,500 miles.
.
I kept a spreadsheet of the parts cost.
It was far below a conventional bike.
Upvote
16
(16
/
0)
Sounds great to me. It solves the described hill-climbing problem and the battery can be light, compact, inexpensive, and quickly charged by a modest sized charger, because it only needs enough capacity for occasional climbing support and not for cruising.
That said, the cost and additional drive chain complexity might not be worth the benefit, especially in a flat area!
Last edited:
Upvote
7
(7
/
0)
Regulations limit E-bike speeds to 28 MPH.
A velomobile can cruise at that speed, or a bit more, with no electric assistance at all.
So in flat areas, the added weight and expense of an electric motor are not attractive at all to most riders.
Upvote
7
(7
/
0)
How much more storage?
They are basically an empty shell inside.
.
Photo below is from this day on 2015, in my Facebook memories.
Here's the text that went with it:
"Picking up groceries on the way home from work in the velomobile. I bought 5 ears of corn, 4 boxes of cold cereal (2 of Life, and 2 of granola), 1 gallon of milk and 1 gallon of orange juice, some oriental mix, some pre-cut watermelon."
Upvote
14
(14
/
0)
Recumbent bicyclists on marked bike lanes in the one city where I have a reason to drive frequently, terrify me, because they are freakin' invisible in many intersections until they are actually in the middleof the intersection, and alongside you in certain quarters of your vision, and like almost way too many bicyclists, often don't feel any obligation to obey traffic lights, speed limits, and other rules. Yes, I notice them, - quite often when it's just short of too late to prevent hitting them. I take no comfort in the fact that if I ever do hit one, it's the bicyclist who is going to be injured, not me.
Upvote
-13
(3
/
-16)
Related to all the hand-wringing about bicyclists above:
In the US, bicycles in general sell in about the same numbers as automobiles.
A year later, 800 bicyclists have died, versus about 40,000 people killed in motor vehicle crashes.
.
Car drivers kill each other, and they kill bicyclists.
It's extremely rare that a bicyclist kills the occupant of a car, another bicyclist, or a pedestrian.
The same cannot be said of car drivers.
In the US, bicycles in general sell in about the same numbers as automobiles.
A year later, 800 bicyclists have died, versus about 40,000 people killed in motor vehicle crashes.
.
Car drivers kill each other, and they kill bicyclists.
It's extremely rare that a bicyclist kills the occupant of a car, another bicyclist, or a pedestrian.
The same cannot be said of car drivers.
Upvote
30
(32
/
-2)
This is partially an observation bias. You won't notice the cyclists who follow laws because you'll pass them and never notice them again because they generally can't re-pass you. The ones skipping stop signs, you'll notice. So a huge percentage of the cyclists you notice are ones breaking laws.
Upvote
17
(19
/
-2)
I dragged my partner’s recumbent out of the garage and fixed it up recently. It’s a lawn chair style trike with giant chopper bars that she calls her ‘couch on wheels’. I’ve only ridden it a little bit whilst adjusting the drive train, but I’m already looking forward to having enough trailer on it for significant grocery work.
The visibility question is real, though. And not just being seen, either; I can barely see when the intersection is clear from down there at the road. I’d never realized just how high up I am on an upright bike.
The visibility question is real, though. And not just being seen, either; I can barely see when the intersection is clear from down there at the road. I’d never realized just how high up I am on an upright bike.
Upvote
3
(3
/
0)
Albino_Boo
Ars Praefectus
There are 278 million motor vehicles registered in the US. There are 54 million cyclists in the US
Upvote
-8
(1
/
-9)
.
Google:
"Light vehicle seasonally adjusted annualized sales (SAAR) for December 2022 was 13.60 million units versus 12.90 million units a year ago. Total 2022 full-year sales of 13,903,429 units were down 7.8% from 2021 year-end totals."
.
"Following the initial interest in cycling, when sales rose by 46 percent year-on-year, U.S. bicycle sales fell to around 17.7 million units in 2022."
Upvote
2
(3
/
-1)
There doesn't appear to be much research out there on this subject, but what I've seen disputes your assertion. Example:
https://electrek.co/2024/01/11/cars...ts-of-study-reveal-who-breaks-more-road-laws/(The study is in Danish hence the link to an English article describing it instead of the study itself.)
Upvote
6
(6
/
0)
That is painting with a very broad brush. Cyclists are not anarchists any more than the vastly more numerous drivers who fail to 'obey traffic lights, speed limits and other rules' are.
Upvote
15
(15
/
0)
I need to call this out as being, at best, lacking nuance.
The Amy Gillett Foundation was created in response to the death of a track cyclist, Amy Gillett, who was out on a training ride in Germany. They've done a lot of research into cycling safety. One of their papers looks at the reasons why cyclists run red lights; in another study where they videotaped a number of intersections during peak cycling time, a very large percentage of the infringements they observed in the recordings was cyclists turning left (equivalent to turning right in the USA) after stopping and looking for traffic (likely because the lights weren't responding to the presence of the cyclist, as they would were they cars.)
Sadly, the foundation is no more, due to a lack of funding, but the papers are a very interesting read, and might give you some insight into why some cyclists do what they do.
Speaking as a cyclist myself, I see far more poor judgement calls from motorists than I do from cyclists - including one incident where I nearly won the door prize (as the saying goes when a driver opens their door to get out without looking; fortunately, I saw it coming and had room to move over to dodge the door.)
Getting back to the original topic at hand, I was out at the local criterium track yesterday for a two hour session, and saw a couple of these going around the track. I was impressed; they looked good, although I suspect the designs I saw were meant more for racing than practicality.
Upvote
12
(12
/
0)
For what it's worth, my experience from walking around Boston for 6ish years is that drivers don't obey traffic lights, speed limits, or other rules, and they're much more lethal to others.
Also, while velomobiles and other recumbents stand out, that point about them being invisible until they're in the intersection is real. And it works both ways. I've had troubles with low barriers like hedges making it unsafe to cross a street while riding a recumbent trike.
Upvote
8
(8
/
0)
Please don't compare sales numbers. Compare deaths per distance travelled.
Upvote
-3
(3
/
-6)
They aren't that good at updating the website. But according to facebook and linkedin they are ramping up deliveries in Germany.
Upvote
0
(1
/
-1)
How about you compare FAULT too ?
Many of the deaths are caused by car/truck/van/lorry drivers, but the number of deaths caused by cyclists is crazy low - there have been a couple of high profile cases where cyclists have hit pedestrians and serious injury / deaths have occurred, but you have to dig really, really deep to find instances.
Over the weekend there were three young people killed locally, a younger driver ran out of talent and landed in a local field, the car burst into flames and the driver and one of the three passengers died at the scene, a third died in hospital the fourth has life changing injuries.
Also this weekend there was the first of the local sportive rides. There were probably minor crashes and breakdowns, but there was no reports of bicycles up-side-down in a field incinerating their occupants.
I have had plenty of crashes on bicycles and have broken bones (collar bone, wrist, ribs), but in all my years of riding (50+), the biggest damage I have managed was some panel / glass damage to a car that left-hooked me - his fault, his insurance admitted it - I was compensated.
So how about you compare number of deaths per distance travelled by fault
For bicycles ?
So let's be really generous ?
Even if we include the numbers that are motor vehicle related and assume that all cyclists put theirselves into harms way deliberately - that is ~ 1/30th of the motor vehicle deaths.
If you assume that drivers drive 12k miles / year - that means that in order to be exactly as lethal as a car, a bicycle once gets ridden 400 miles / year - seven miles / week.
Hmmm...
Upvote
11
(12
/
-1)
Chains wear when they are flexed under load (the pivot pins minutely wear away). Given you've got ~3x as much chain, you'd expect ~3x longer chain life, as each chain link will encounter a sprocket roughly 1/3 as often. Yes chain life is better in a cleaner environment, but that isn't as big a part of the reason as you might think in this scenario.
Upvote
6
(7
/
-1)
There's a series of trails nearly connecting Milwaukee to the Mississippi river. Since getting back into cycling I've been eyeing those and wondering what it might take to tackle such a treck.
Would be really cool to go so far by bicycle on bicycle infrastructure, but as it stands right now I'm only biking about 2.5-3 miles per day (but Google says it's about 200 feet of vertical climb I'm tackling in those short miles, so maybe I've got far further in me than I realize)
Would be really cool to go so far by bicycle on bicycle infrastructure, but as it stands right now I'm only biking about 2.5-3 miles per day (but Google says it's about 200 feet of vertical climb I'm tackling in those short miles, so maybe I've got far further in me than I realize)
Upvote
1
(1
/
0)
I sympathize with a lot of this, but one reason I ride (and drive) defensively is that it won't matter whose fault it is if I'm dead.
Upvote
6
(8
/
-2)
Make this an e-bike, put a narrow fin or sail (about 12" width front to rear x 24" tall) on the roof with a rear facing red light set, and a front facing white light set, and go and print money.
Upvote
-1
(0
/
-1)
Thanks for the article. I've been riding bikes most of my life and recumbents for many years but switched over to a velomobile about a year and a half ago, mainly for increased efficiency and safety. Never really had a problem with riding upright bicycles (except for occasional sore-ass-itis) and know the simplicity, compactness and light weight can be advantages. My newest velomobile is a Bulk like the one in the article, but with tiller steering which is probably easier to get used to than tank steering. The Bulk is really fun to ride and efficient, I have over 3200 miles on mine in the first 5 months of use.
A velomobile can be a moderate investment, but Velomobile World has recently introduced a new model: Bulk 4 More, at a much lower price point. The ongoing costs of a velomobile are low and with the weather protection and cargo carrying capacity some people (even in colder climates) have gone car free after buying one.
A line frequently repeated is most owners don't ride any other bike after getting a velomobile and that's my experience.
A velomobile can be a moderate investment, but Velomobile World has recently introduced a new model: Bulk 4 More, at a much lower price point. The ongoing costs of a velomobile are low and with the weather protection and cargo carrying capacity some people (even in colder climates) have gone car free after buying one.
A line frequently repeated is most owners don't ride any other bike after getting a velomobile and that's my experience.
Upvote
3
(3
/
0)
My city recently installed bike lanes downtown complete with their own traffic signals. Out of the dozens of cyclists I've seen at those intersections only one actually waited for "their" light. Of the three car-bike accidents I've witnessed, in two of them the car was stopped and hit by a biker not paying attention, and in the other the biker went past two lanes of stopped traffic at a light only to go over the top of the car in the left hand turn lane who had a green light. I support biking and approve of the bike lanes but please don't try to tell me how none of the issues are the bikers fault.
Upvote
-7
(2
/
-9)
As far as I know, there are no regulations on this. But from my experience, they stand up pretty well. I have had one accident in my Strada, back when I first got it 10y ago.
The back wheel suddenly stepped out (I think it caught in a ridge or something), and catapulted me into a concrete post at 35kph. I got out without a scratch. I was able to get the nose somewhat into shape for the rest of the ride back home, but the front subframe was bent, and repairing the fairing wasn't cheap. I do prefer that over broken bones though.
Upvote
7
(7
/
0)
I suspect that the biggest design issue will be to ensure adequate cooling without dramatically increasing drag. This reminds me of the initial designs for a ducted fan within the propeller spinner of the Focke Wolf FW190A. It proved to be inadequate for engine cooling. After all, the Volomobile and the FW190A both have air cooled engines.
Upvote
2
(2
/
0)
I don't think anyone's saying that none of the fault lies with the bicyclists. The general consensus seems to be that people are breaking rules at roughly the same rate regardless of method of transportation. What many are reacting to here is the idea that bicyclists are more prone to rule breaking than other groups, and that this is a significant cause of accidents. This seems to be what you're reacting to as well, just on behalf of the drivers, so I think we actually agree on this.
IMHO, ultimately the fault lies with the infrastructure. If it's bad then the results are bad, and arguing whether it's the drivers or bicyclists that are to blame is unproductive.
Upvote
12
(12
/
0)
Actually, I would argue that bicyclists are more prone to rule breaking. Go to any intersection with a stop sign and count what percentage of cars and bikes actually come to a complete stop. I'll wait for the results.
Upvote
-13
(0
/
-13)
Have you done this? Assuming that you're in a region where bicyclists are required by law to stop at stop signs (in several regions they are not), the results should be roughly equal according to the studies I've seen. (Which I'm pretty sure means close to 0% for both in my region... But that's a different story.)
Upvote
7
(7
/
0)