What could possibly go wrong? DOGE to rapidly rebuild Social Security codebase.

Madestjohn

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And even then, you'd miss all kinds of intricacies and hacks and bugfixes.

This is not a green-field project, where you'd do a basic flow, then a data model, then a workflow, and then start coding. You could do that, and you probably would even doing it right now. The problem is that when you're done with that in 2-3 years, you're going to do your first parallel run full check issue and holy fucking shit, you've done super-well, and you match the existing system 95% of the time. That's absolutely awesome, champagne all around. Except no, not really, because switching over at that point means that 3,650,000 people are not getting the checks that for most of them is their entire income.

Cool. Okay. We'll just fix some shit.

6 months later, you're at 99%. So now only 730,000 people are going to be fucked. Nobody is signing off on that, they're going to want at least 3, most likely 4 9s. Anything less than that would collapse the entire support system.

And back you go. You're probably into the esoteric veteran who emigrated and came back and married another veteran but blah blah blah kind of territory, you know, the idiotic exceptions you never considered -- but amongst 73,000,000 accounts, there's going to be thousands upon thousands of those.

That is all assuming competent people are doing this. Musk's minions, with a bit of Python in college, and maybe some intern-level C stuff are going to do this? Pull me another one. I wouldn't trust those asshats to make something that is fast enough to crank out the checks required (keep in mind, this is optimized COBOL with hand-written assembler in critical paths), let alone those checks being correct. I would not trust them to pick the right tools and languages, let alone design a proper horizontal sharding strategy. These are fucking idiots, and that's kind of the point.
but Elon always calls for a complete ‘rewrite of the stack’
its his go to move to prove his metal against a room of programers
 
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I am not so confident that a recession would automatically benefit the right when it’s very clear where the cause is. And if they refuse to leave power I am more confident they will be removed here.
We'll probably have to agree to disagree on a lot of things, but yeah, not that one. As a random example, if a French government screwed over farmers the way Trump did US soy farmers like he did in his first administration, or USAID contracting farms like he did just now, there'd be burning farm equipment for 100 miles on every highway out of Paris. For starters.
 
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but Elon always calls for a complete ‘rewrite of the stack’
its his go to move to prove his metal against a room of programers
I am the biggest Microsoft homer you will ever find. No, seriously. But his PayPal push to switch to Windows "just because" is just as idiotic as a lot of the current pushes the other way. Dude, it fucking works, what is wrong with you?
 
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Madestjohn

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I am the biggest Microsoft homer you will ever find. No, seriously. But his PayPal push to switch to Windows "just because" is just as idiotic as a lot of the current pushes the other way. Dude, it fucking works, what is wrong with you?
i don’t think he ever learned or was comfortable with unix/linux

he was a M$ script kiddy once and always

(the complete stack rewrite is from of course the notorious group call after his twitter purchase)
 
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CommanderJameson

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but Elon always calls for a complete ‘rewrite of the stack’
its his go to move to prove his metal against a room of programers
If you have a shitty production stack, you have a problem.

If you then decide to completely re-write that stack, you have n problems, where n tends to infinity.

Elon thinks his call to “rewrite the stack” is big senior dev energy. It’s actually “trainee programmer” energy.
 
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CommanderJameson

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We'll probably have to agree to disagree on a lot of things, but yeah, not that one. As a random example, if a French government screwed over farmers the way Trump did US soy farmers like he did in his first administration, or USAID contracting farms like he did just now, there'd be burning farm equipment for 100 miles on every highway out of Paris. For starters.
Imagine what French farmers would be like if they had the 2A there.
 
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Liam Ham

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Honestly, get rid of the whole social security system entirely. It's only sustainable in a country with rising birth rates, which is not the USA anymore with 1.3 children being born per couple.

It can be phased out slowly, where people 56-67 continue to pay the standard amount in to ss and are promised to receive 100% of it, people 45-55 pay 75% of ss tax and will receive 75% of today's amount, etc etc until people 16-25 pay nothing towards social security with the idea being that people need to start investing their own money to plan for retirement based on how much time they still have to plan for said retirement.

As proof of concept, starting at 22 years old put away $400 (roughly what the average person pays in ss every month) into a HYSA earning 4% interest every month until you're 72. That will balloon to $750k, which will earn $2554 every month in interest. If you can live off the interest, great, but even withdrawing enough to have $3500 available every month would take over 30 years to blow through. When you factor in other retirement incomes like a 401k, pension, and whatever other savings you've had, this blows social security completely out of the water. The average person receives $1900 a month from social security checks. Doing my method yields over $2500 a month for the average person AT LEAST in perpetuity.

Why should I have to keep paying for other people's fiscal incompetence, especially when the whole system will be bled dry by baby boomers living to be 105 years old anyway? You just have to not be a total idiot and be smart with your money. The social safety net has to go, sink or swim.
 
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DeeplyUnconcerned

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I’m surprised that we’re over 1000 comments in and nobody has linked this classic text yet: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/04/06/things-you-should-never-do-part-i/

Tl;dr you should ~never rewrite from scratch, because your messy codebase is just a reflection of the messy business logic you need to implement, and a clean rewrite will just reimplement all the bugs that the mess was added to fix.

Honestly I would not be surprised to find that something as old and as complex as the SSA system was provably unimplementable from scratch at this stage in its lifecycle, in a new-requirements-are-discovered-faster-than-rate-of-implementation kind of way.
 
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Madestjohn

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alisonken1

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I’m surprised that we’re over 1000 comments in and nobody has linked this classic text yet: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/04/06/things-you-should-never-do-part-i/

Tl;dr you should ~never rewrite from scratch, because your messy codebase is just a reflection of the messy business logic you need to implement, and a clean rewrite will just reimplement all the bugs that the mess was added to fix.

Honestly I would not be surprised to find that something as old and as complex as the SSA system was provably unimplementable from scratch at this stage in its lifecycle, in a new-requirements-are-discovered-faster-than-rate-of-implementation kind of way.
Upvote for Joel reference!
 
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SeanJW

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Government-funded? I assume you left off the scare quotes intentionally. I have receipts for the SSI contributions both me and my employers have made on my behalf for several decades, and from a glance at my 401K, I would be seeing a much nicer return on those dollars than what I may be getting if the program is still around in a few years when I'm ready to ask for that money back.

That wording is terrible - social security payments (and tax in general) isn't a savings account. You're not getting any of it back. You're paying everyone else on social security right now. When you're on social security, you're relying on the largesse of voters then, what you've already paid is irrelevant.

(I nearly said "not an investment", but it is an investment.... in other people though, not financially)
 
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SeanJW

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I am the biggest Microsoft homer you will ever find. No, seriously. But his PayPal push to switch to Windows "just because" is just as idiotic as a lot of the current pushes the other way. Dude, it fucking works, what is wrong with you?

Even Microsoft didn't make that mistake when they took over Hotmail. (Not that they didn't try, but they certainly realised it was a no-go.)
 
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graylshaped

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That wording is terrible - social security payments (and tax in general) isn't a savings account. You're not getting any of it back. You're paying everyone else on social security right now. When you're on social security, you're relying on the largesse of voters then, what you've already paid is irrelevant.

(I nearly said "not an investment", but it is an investment.... in other people though, not financially)
I'm not sure whose wording you don't like: I was using the OP's metaphor to point out the government acts as broker and quasi-underwriter with respect to SSI, rather than being the source of funds.

I'm well aware my payments went to my grandparents and their peers; should the program still be around in a few years anything coming my way would be coming from your kids and mine. Whether that's a type of pyramid scheme or a sanctioned, non-optional pay-it-forward multi-generational partnership depends on one's perspective.
 
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