Musk claims Neuralink patient doing OK with implant, can move mouse with brain

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orwelldesign

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This... Isn't new? At the BCI lab at UCSD my professor was doing this in 2001. Didn't need to let a robot do brain surgery, they could do it with a skullcap.

Also, eff that "prime" acronymization. That is probably the worst example of a forced acronym I've ever seen, and I've seen some doozies.
 
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thekaj

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Moving a mouse cursor by thinking doesn't require invasive implants. I did psychology at uni in the early 2000s, and we had a device that could do that just with external electrodes (which did nothing worse than make your hair a bit messy with the glue when you took them off!).
I'm personally shocked that Musk has likely spent hundreds of millions on something that replicates a device that was available 20 years ago and is presenting it as a big deal.
Assuming that some brain-computer interface device was indeed implanted in some patient with severe paralysis by some surgeons somewhere
Emphasis mine. I've read comments on how the fact that the FDA signed off on clinical trials didn't eliminate the need for surgeons to get approval from various medical associations before performing the procedure. Which they didn't. So either this procedure took place in the US and any doctors that took part would be endangering their licenses if it became known who they are, or the procedure was done outside of the US. This quote seems to allude to this.
 
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Corporations experimenting on humans is nothing new. They are not bound by any moral or ethical standards to which most researchers must adhere to in order to get funded or to publish their work. Musk can just tweet that he created a real cyborg and the world will believe him... this is just another example why the billionaire class is dangerous and should not exist.
 
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Maestro4k

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For some reason when I read the headline about moving a mouse with their brain along with the small preview image of the chip my wonky brain decided this meant moving an actual mouse of the rodent family. That'd be a lot more impressive, since it'd be telekenesis. :eng101:

Part of me wants to feel sorry for the person that had the chip implanted (assuming they're real, Musk lying about this is a distinct possibility), but being stupid enough to let a Musk-controlled company do brain surgery on them negates all attempts at summoning up some sympathy/concern. That's pretty much asking for permanent brain damage if you're lucky, death if you're not.
 
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Adept

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Conjecture and personal bias are ruining actual factual news.

Welcome latest sockpuppet! What conjecture and personal bias did you uncover in your thorough reading of the article (that you don't even know what it's about according to your own admission). What did you find that was not "actual factual" in this article?
 
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My concern is that I haven't read anything that conclusively states that they've solved the fouling issue (often the body forms a coating around foreign objects - which would make them no longer able to communicate with the neuron; I know the thinness of the probes partially address the issue but haven't seen enough details to give me strong certainty that the implant won't be worthless in 5 years)
 
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The only ethical obligation is to the patient as far as contingency plans, they might also have a legal obligation to whatever oversight there is. As to 'false hope' - it always exists for clinical trials because many are not successful.

As to non-invasive methods - people are free to pursue those, thus far the research doesn't seem to promising - if there is one that is successful then it will surely win out, but currently their information resolution is quite poor.
Their information resolution is orders of magnitude better than Neuralink's so far.
 
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thekaj

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Wait:

"Caplan and Moreno acknowledged that Neuralink and Musk seem to be "in the clear" legally"

All I see is a lot of whining here.

After their whining they even admit, they are following legal guidelines. What is this article even about. Conjecture and personal bias are ruining actual factual news.
I guess you missed the sub-headlines?

Medical ethicists alarmed by Musk being "sole source of information" on patient.​

“Basic ethical standards” not met​

 
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Findecanor

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Moving a mouse cursor by thinking doesn't require invasive implants. I did psychology at uni in the early 2000s, and we had a device that could do that just with external electrodes (which did nothing worse than make your hair a bit messy with the glue when you took them off!).
I knew a couple art students that did it back in '99. No medical training. Art students. They used EEG equipment they had found in a dumpster.
 
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Snark218

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Yeah...I'm going on the skeptical side with this one.
Hey, he might be technically telling the truth! He said the patient could move a mouse. He didn't claim the patient could do anything useful with it or that the implant would remain functioning or that the patient wouldn't end up dying terribly at some point.
 
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