FBI probes arson of Tesla cars and facilities, says “this is domestic terrorism”

FBI director: Agency "investigating increase in violent activity toward Tesla."

See full article...

 

[Zeroumus]

Let me get this straight: throwing Molotov cocktails at dealerships and charging stations counts as mere "protesting," but cutting bureaucracy is "terrorism"? Your moral compass might need recalibrating.

Insurance payouts don't magically erase criminality; they certainly don't justify torching private property because you're angry at someone's politics. Peaceful protesting is one thing; defending outright violence as legitimate activism is precisely the logic that breeds extremism.

And suggesting Tesla somehow profits off arson attacks is both ridiculous and morally repulsive. Perhaps reflect a bit before your next attempt to defend domestic terrorism.

Just to be clear, when you say cut bureaucracy, i hear accepting corruption. I stopped reading after that .

Its a question i am here alot from dumb maga. " why dont you like elon cutting waste"? . I dont like it cuz he is cutting things that are generally good and keeping shit that is bad. its not even about saving money

 

[mordann]

So this was SpaceX's recovery vessel hoist mock up then?

 

[stk5]

Considering similar activist tactics were deployed by Lenin, Mao, and Nazis, I wouldn't be so sure.

Hmm, you seem to be breathing air contained within Earth's lower atmosphere. You know who else breathed air contained within Earth's lower atmosphere? That's right, it was that rascal Hitler

 

[daveishereagain]

Considering similar activist tactics were deployed by Lenin, Mao, and Nazis, I wouldn't be so sure.

What a load. The pieces of shit you reference were all attempting -and succeeded-to overthrow the status quo and the rule of law.
These arsonists are protesting to keep it. There's a difference in the goal such actions were perpetrated to achieve.

 

[mrkite77]

Burning cars = terrorism
Driving into protestors = patriotism

 

[Frodo Douchebaggins]

Not at this time of morning.

There's no wrong time for a bondi burger with pineapple

I hate that one of my favorite foods has been name-corrupted by that malignant cancer of a human.

 

[Zeroumus]

To much mental energy being wasted here..

MAGA, your fucking dumb and i want your beliefs destroyed.

 

[atmartens]

I'm guessing the 'unwashed masses' that don't frequent Ars are quite happy with everything that is going on, even if some of it negatively effects them. I just checked and it looks like his approval polls are hovering close to 50% right now.

It is your opinion that his base was tricked. I don't think they were. Most of what he has done was foreseeable based on his running points. I'll support anyone that either effectively helps remedy the government debt situation (kill entitlements/non critical spending) or promotes economic growth in the US (deregulation). If we don't fix the deficit then we are depending on our economic growth to outpace the increasing debt.

A situation where the economy doesn't grow fast enough, we increase entitlements, and we have high interest and further government regulations ultimately results in a true and actual debt crisis eventually. Were that to come to pass things would be so much worse for the US than what Trump is promoting right now.

Do you know right now the federal government has borrowed about 2.7 trillion dollars from the social security fund AND that the social security fund quit making money in 2021 and now pays out more than it takes in? So what was a cash cow for them up to now will soon be another massive bill in the mailbox on top of everything else.

Entitlements like Social Security are called that because we're entitled to them because the money was taken out of our paychecks. Killing Social Security to fund tax cuts for the ultra-wealthy is robbing the working class to create a neo-aristocracy. This is the sort of scenario in which the guillotines come out and heads roll. The French nobility didn't see it coming and neither do these assholes.

 

[seitojack]

You vandalize a US Capitol, you get a pardon. You vandalize a Tesla, you get marked as a domestic terrorist. We are now officially a Corporate States of America.

 

[robco]

I'm guessing the 'unwashed masses' that don't frequent Ars are quite happy with everything that is going on, even if some of it negatively effects them. I just checked and it looks like his approval polls are hovering close to 50% right now.

It is your opinion that his base was tricked. I don't think they were. Most of what he has done was foreseeable based on his running points. I'll support anyone that either effectively helps remedy the government debt situation (kill entitlements/non critical spending) or promotes economic growth in the US (deregulation). If we don't fix the deficit then we are depending on our economic growth to outpace the increasing debt.

A situation where the economy doesn't grow fast enough, we increase entitlements, and we have high interest and further government regulations ultimately results in a true and actual debt crisis eventually. Were that to come to pass things would be so much worse for the US than what Trump is promoting right now.

Do you know right now the federal government has borrowed about 2.7 trillion dollars from the social security fund AND that the social security fund quit making money in 2021 and now pays out more than it takes in? So what was a cash cow for them up to now will soon be another massive bill in the mailbox on top of everything else.

Typical MAGA, completely, proudly, and willfully ignorant. Republicans got us into this. Reagan exploded deficits while ramping up defense spending to grind down the Soviets. His VP continued this through his term. Clinton came onto the scene and worked with the GOP Congress to balance the budget. Bush II came along, saw the gains and decided that his wealthy buddies needed a tax cut. This exploded the deficit. There were no war bonds or other financing arranged for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, so those exploded the deficit as well. Bush's VP famously said that Reagan showed us deficits don't matter. Obama worked with the GOP again to reduce deficits over his two terms. Trump added $7T (trillion with a T) in his first term. The GOP are deficit peacocks.

The SS withholding cap for this year is $176,100. Anyone making above that no longer pays into the program. If we raised or eliminated this cap, we could bring in quite a bit of money to make the program solvent. Tax the fuck out of the rich.

 

[Pishaw]

By your logic, every dollar spent inefficiently or lost to bureaucratic overhead is a life taken, so perhaps you should consider the lives bureaucratic inefficiency itself has cost. If moral outrage is your currency, selective accounting won’t help your cause. Hyperbole doesn't strengthen your argument; it dilutes any genuine point you might've had.

So you're equating cutting bureaucracy with accepting corruption? That's quite the leap. Bureaucracy often shields corruption under layers of inefficiency, where accountability goes to die quietly. Reducing layers of red tape doesn't mean surrendering oversight, it means focusing accountability clearly where it belongs, instead of letting it drown in paperwork. Your argument seems less about protecting good governance and more about preserving a system that conveniently obscures who's actually accountable.

If this is too much "mental energy" for you, feel free to bow out. It's telling, though, that you don't bother to defend your own position beyond "MAGA bad," as if insults could replace an actual argument. Wanting opposing beliefs "destroyed" rather than challenged suggests you're not interested in democracy or dialogue, you're just uncomfortable with differing opinions existing at all.

I wonder if you'll reconsider your position when Trumps people come for your fucking guns and money?

 

[Kaiser Sosei]

I'll support anyone that either effectively helps remedy the government debt situation (kill entitlements/non critical spending) or promotes economic growth in the US (deregulation). If we don't fix the deficit then we are depending on our economic growth to outpace the increasing debt.

A situation where the economy doesn't grow fast enough, we increase entitlements, and we have high interest and further government regulations ultimately results in a true and actual debt crisis eventually. Were that to come to pass things would be so much worse for the US than what Trump is promoting right now.

Do you know right now the federal government has borrowed about 2.7 trillion dollars from the social security fund AND that the social security fund quit making money in 2021 and now pays out more than it takes in? So what was a cash cow for them up to now will soon be another massive bill in the mailbox on top of everything else.

You seem very concerned about the government debt, you know what would fix all that? Bringing back the 1950's tax rates including 90+ percent for the highest earners.

 

[zaghahzag]

I think when you're throwing molotov cocktails and setting fires it could be considered terrorism. But in this case, who exactly are the people being terrorized? Nazis?

No. It's arson, destruction of property, etc. It's not terrorism.

 

[donfelipe]

By your logic, every dollar spent inefficiently or lost to bureaucratic overhead is a life taken, so perhaps you should consider the lives bureaucratic inefficiency itself has cost. If moral outrage is your currency, selective accounting won’t help your cause. Hyperbole doesn't strengthen your argument; it dilutes any genuine point you might've had.

So you're equating cutting bureaucracy with accepting corruption? That's quite the leap. Bureaucracy often shields corruption under layers of inefficiency, where accountability goes to die quietly. Reducing layers of red tape doesn't mean surrendering oversight, it means focusing accountability clearly where it belongs, instead of letting it drown in paperwork. Your argument seems less about protecting good governance and more about preserving a system that conveniently obscures who's actually accountable.

If this is too much "mental energy" for you, feel free to bow out. It's telling, though, that you don't bother to defend your own position beyond "MAGA bad," as if insults could replace an actual argument. Wanting opposing beliefs "destroyed" rather than challenged suggests you're not interested in democracy or dialogue, you're just uncomfortable with differing opinions existing at all.

Reducing bureaucracy doesn’t start with destroying government functions and firing workers. In a functioning government that would start with legislation. Workers are hired to do jobs in departments and agencies created by congress. Only a piece of shit billionaire CEO would blame workers for doing what they are hired to do.

If you don’t think this whole thing is a corrupt coup, answer this: Who the is Elon Musk to be making these decisions? What is his position in government? And why isn’t it corruption that he owns companies that have, are currently, and will hold government contracts?

 

[Frodo Douchebaggins]

I wonder if you'll reconsider your position when Trumps people come for your fucking guns and money?

Reminder: trump implemented more gun control in his first term than Biden.

 

[Faceless Man]

Oakberry for a pre-surf Açaí bowl?

You do live in Bondi, don't you?

 

[Frodo Douchebaggins]

Typical MAGA, completely, proudly, and willfully ignorant. Republicans got us into this. Reagan exploded deficits while ramping up defense spending to grind down the Soviets. His VP continued this through his term. Clinton came onto the scene and worked with the GOP Congress to balance the budget. Bush II came along, saw the gains and decided that his wealthy buddies needed a tax cut. This exploded the deficit. There were no war bonds or other financing arranged for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, so those exploded the deficit as well. Bush's VP famously said that Reagan showed us deficits don't matter. Obama worked with the GOP again to reduce deficits over his two terms. Trump added $7T (trillion with a T) in his first term. The GOP are deficit peacocks.

The SS withholding cap for this year is $176,100. Anyone making above that no longer pays into the program. If we raised or eliminated this cap, we could bring in quite a bit of money to make the program solvent. Tax the fuck out of the rich.

That cap has gotta go.

 

[Faceless Man]

There's no wrong time for a bondi burger with pineapple

I hate that one of my favorite foods has been name-corrupted by that malignant cancer of a human.

I hate that you can now get a Bondi Burger with a sauce other than chili. Used to be simple - Bondi Burger: chili, Norm Burger: no chili. But now you can get it with Prego sauce or Otropo or aioli or whatever. It shouldn't be a Bondi Burger if it doesn't have Oporto Original Chili sauce on it.

 

[mhalpern]

I'm not with you on this. According to the law: View attachment 105948
It's a concerted effort to intimidate the public to stop purchasing from Tesla due to government policies. And that is the exact effect it's having.

it's an inconsistent application of a terrorism charge, which pretty much always involves intent to cause bodily harm (usually lethal) as part of the process, rather than property damage

 

[zdanee]

Okay, but then what the POTUS and Tesco-Ironman does is pretty much treason. People used to be hanged for that not that long ago...

 

[Qyygle]

By your logic, every dollar spent inefficiently or lost to bureaucratic overhead is a life taken, so perhaps you should consider the lives bureaucratic inefficiency itself has cost. If moral outrage is your currency, selective accounting won’t help your cause. Hyperbole doesn't strengthen your argument; it dilutes any genuine point you might've had.

So you're equating cutting bureaucracy with accepting corruption? That's quite the leap. Bureaucracy often shields corruption under layers of inefficiency, where accountability goes to die quietly. Reducing layers of red tape doesn't mean surrendering oversight, it means focusing accountability clearly where it belongs, instead of letting it drown in paperwork. Your argument seems less about protecting good governance and more about preserving a system that conveniently obscures who's actually accountable.

If this is too much "mental energy" for you, feel free to bow out. It's telling, though, that you don't bother to defend your own position beyond "MAGA bad," as if insults could replace an actual argument. Wanting opposing beliefs "destroyed" rather than challenged suggests you're not interested in democracy or dialogue, you're just uncomfortable with differing opinions existing at all.

Yes, the classic means of fixing a house by bulldozing it with all occupants still inside.

Some people just seem to understand that doing things is hard, while others are apparently content to believe that tech-bro BS will solve all our problems by move fast and break things.
I've spent a good chunk of my life toiling away in civil service. If there's corruption to be rooted out, I've a feeling that firing 50% of our staff and gutting the programs we run will do absolutely fuck all in that regard. We had AG's for a reason, until Trump fired them.

You want to save money on the federal budget? That'll take hard work at understanding the use of funds, working with Congress to remove onerous or mis-written regs, discussion with constituents to understand what needs really should be met and what can be disposed of.

This is hard, boring, monotonous work. If you think cutting it all to the ground is saving anything, you're just an idiot. My salary is peanut crumbs compared to the federal deficit. Some bureaucrats might be inefficient or lazy.
You want to know why? Because being paid 30-50% of what an adequately competent equivalent in the private sector means the brain drain in the public sector is immense. Either we're dedicated to public service, or, we have the less than stellar remnants.

You want to know how to fix that? Make public service meaningful again. Make it attractive or beneficial to work for local, state, federal government. You want a broken government, hardly able to manage weather forecasts, handle pandemic outbreaks, audit tax season, or stem foreign influence on American lives? We're heading right at that fucking iceberg and every alarm bell has been ringing for the past year.
Keep telling yourself how bright your little worldview is. I really don't care about this stupid MAGA worldview anymore. You asked for a shit sandwich, perhaps we should just start serving that.

 

[wildsman]

Also when Tesla property gets damaged or destroyed they're being paid by insurance companies and almost certainly profiting on it.

Wait who is profiting from it?

If you're referring to the owners of the Teslas, they're going to have their premiums go through the roof as the risk goes up. You do realise that an insurance company doesn't really care whose fault it is right? The mere fact that you own a Tesla now means your premium will shoot up.

OTOH, if you're referring to Tesla, people are going to be returning/steering away from Tesla because of all this stuff.

Say what you will of the actions of these protesters, but it will be highly effective in damaging Tesla and that is their aim. The Tesla owners are collateral damage sadly.

 

[Frodo Douchebaggins]

I hate that you can now get a Bondi Burger with a sauce other than chili. Used to be simple - Bondi Burger: chili, Norm Burger: no chili. But now you can get it with Prego sauce or Otropo or aioli or whatever. It shouldn't be a Bondi Burger if it doesn't have Oporto Original Chili sauce on it.

10000%

Going wayyyy off topic now but -


I spent an absurd amount of time and energy replicating their chilli sauce when I moved to the US because there is nothing remotely similar to it here. But now there's always some in my fridge!

(it's the sort of gen2 sauce they had for a long time, I haven't been back since they switched back to the original recipe, so I don't have samples to compare to)

 

[Darkly]

When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and have a corporate sponsor.

When? When?... It's already there.

 

[TheMolesRevenge]

 

[wildsman]

I know some people have speculated Musk might be behind it to get insurance money, which raises a good point, even if it IS people who are "against" Musk doing this, he will still be getting insurance money. I think these arsonists are only helping Musk - he gets insurance money on cars he wasn't selling, while he also gets at least some people rallying around him and decrying the "terrorists" who are committing arson.

If any of those fires spreads and starts damaging other property and possibly harming people, the backlash against all Tesla protests could get really ugly really fast, and support for Musk would likely go up.

I really wish the arsonists would knock it off - there's far better ways to protest that don't result in giving Musk multiple benefits.

The best way to hurt Musk is to just make sure those cars sit on lots, unsold, with no insurance bailouts.

But, I also must recognize that yes, there is a possibility Musk is behind it, and if he is, he likely will never face consequences, because of being granted almost total power by Trump.

That's not how insurance works. If it is that risky, think about his premiums. Insurance companies aren't going to quietly take the losses on Teslas - they will jack up the premiums.

 

[UhtredsonofUhtred]

Let me get this straight: throwing Molotov cocktails at dealerships and charging stations counts as mere "protesting," but cutting bureaucracy is "terrorism"? Your moral compass might need recalibrating.

Insurance payouts don't magically erase criminality; they certainly don't justify torching private property because you're angry at someone's politics. Peaceful protesting is one thing; defending outright violence as legitimate activism is precisely the logic that breeds extremism.

And suggesting Tesla somehow profits off arson attacks is both ridiculous and morally repulsive. Perhaps reflect a bit before your next attempt to defend domestic terrorism.

Fucking sanctimonious pearl-clutching quislings are a special kind of ick.

 

[graylshaped]

In related news, reports of minorities being detained without warrants or charges by armed men continue to mount, with no indications the trend is a concern to authorities.

 

[imchillyb]

Arson is already a crime.
Vandalism is already a crime.
Destruction of property is already a crime.

Terrorism is a convenient label that can be used in any way they choose, on anyone they choose, for any reason they choose.

Why not charge the individuals with the crimes they actually committed? Yeah...

 

[Frodo Douchebaggins]

Wait who is profiting from it?
[snip]
OTOH, if you're referring to Tesla, people are going to be returning/steering away from Tesla because of all this stuff.

Say what you will of the actions of these protesters, but it will be highly effective in damaging Tesla and that is their aim. The Tesla owners are collateral damage sadly.

My cynical gut feeling is that it allows them to get paid for unsold cars that were destroyed and collect money for them, and I don't doubt there is enough corruption to make sure their insurance premiums aren't affected.

But yes, fortunately, sales are cratering too.

 

[Faceless Man]

10000%

Going wayyyy off topic now but -


I spent an absurd amount of time and energy replicating their chilli sauce when I moved to the US because there is nothing remotely similar to it here. But now there's always some in my fridge!

(it's the sort of gen2 sauce they had for a long time, I haven't been back since they switched back to the original recipe, so I don't have samples to compare to)

View attachment 105954

So that makes two people I know who did that. Unless you're the same person. (I'm not going to speculate on anyone's identity on a public message board, but I suspect not for a couple of key reasons.)

[ETA] Oh, yeah, the Gen 2 sauce was pretty good. I may have been a little over-specific. But it still needs to be chili, goshdarnit.

 

[papito10]

Mobs tasing cops and trying to stop vote certification - "Not an insurrection! Peaceful tourists!"

Some Deploreans catch fire - "DOMESTIC TERRRISM!"

 

[papito10]

I read two days ago about all the ATF, FBI, DSS, IRS, etc. agents that have been pulled from normal duties to go after undocumented immigrants. Then today we are going to redirect to provide Musk his personal investigative service. Freaking ridiculous

My fear is that while Kash Patel is collecting pokemons, the rest of us are just waiting to be targets of actual terrorists. No one is watching the gates.

 

[Frodo Douchebaggins]

My fear is that while Kash Patel is collecting pokemons, the rest of us are just waiting to be targets of actual terrorists. No one is watching the gates.

Nah c'mon, this is definitely the look of someone who is focusing on the job

 

[cfenton]

I'm not with you on this. According to the law: View attachment 105948
It's a concerted effort to intimidate the public to stop purchasing from Tesla due to government policies. And that is the exact effect it's having.

Setting an unoccupied car on fire isn't dangerous to human life. It's definitely a crime and people should be prosecuted for it, but it's hardly terrorism.

 

[EBone]

For those of you keeping track of the Republican party's positions:

School Shootings - OK

Attacking the Capitol - OK

Cancelling Women’s Rights - OK

Vandalizing a Tesla - HOW FUCKING DARE YOU THAT’S DOMESTIC TERRORISM WE WILL COME DOWN ON YOU WITH THE FULL FORCE OF THE DOJ AND SEND YOU TO GITMO